August 14, 2017 · OPINION
What we should learn from violence in Charlottesville
A Virginia law — unenforced Saturday — makes it a felony to conceal one’s identity with a mask in public places.
By Kathryn Schumacher
If you are sucked into the argument of who’s condemning the right face of hate, you’ve been led down a dead end.
Defining which is worse — ANTIFA, BLM or white supremacy — is pointless. They are one in the same — all ideologies of hate and division. Hate will always be with us and so will these fringe groups. Can we ever as humans eradicate or categorize hate? All hate is evil.
The real travesty and the point of our condemnation, especially for Virginians, should be the breakdown of law and order and those elected officials entrusted with protecting the public. Why are we now hearing reports the police pulled back in Charlottesville like they did in San Jose or that two clashing demonstrations were allowed to merge like in Berkeley? Why was Virginia Code 18.2-422 not enforced?
§ 18.2-422. Prohibition of wearing of masks in certain places; exceptions.
It shall be unlawful for any person over 16 years of age to, with the intent to conceal his identity, wear any mask, hood or other device whereby a substantial portion of the face is hidden or property in this Commonwealth without first having obtained from the owner or tenant thereof consent to do so in writing. However, the provisions of this section shall not apply to persons (i) wearing traditional holiday costumes; (ii) engaged in professions, trades, employment or other activities and wearing protective masks which are deemed necessary for the physical safety of the wearer or other persons; (iii) engaged in any bona fide theatrical production or masquerade ball; or (iv) wearing a mask, hood or other device for bona fide medical reasons upon (a) the advice of a licensed physician or osteopath and carrying on his person an affidavit from the physician or osteopath specifying the medical necessity for wearing the device and the date on which the wearing of the device will no longer be necessary and providing a brief description of the device, or (b) the declaration of a disaster or state of emergency by the Governor in response to a public health emergency where the emergency declaration expressly waives this section, defines the mask appropriate for the emergency, and provides for the duration of the waiver. The violation of any provisions of this section is a Class 6 felony.
Our condemnation should be focused today on who failed, either negligently or willfully, to protect our citizens. We must not lose the right to peaceful assembly, but mobs allowed to roam our towns and cities should not be tolerated.
Elected officials who fail to ensure the protection of citizens from such should be called out as failures. The elected officials who failed to plan for, anticipate problems, and put in place adequate policing should be condemned. Lives were lost.
BJ · August 30, 2017 at 8:34 pm
Time is the only commodity we ALL are in short supply of, why do people want to spend it in hate and anger. Why do they do this? What drives them? Where do they think this will lead them? When will people understand they are strengthened by the discord between us, neighbor to neighbor? How can we as a community prevent this from happening in our area? Let's take away that power by working together, not mud slinging and name calling. Neither political party has clean hands, that's why I vote for who I think will be the best leader for our country, not a party. This last time around both party candidates were missing the "right ingredient" to make a successful President. When candidates spend millions and millions of dollars to get an office there is something very wrong with our system. If you stop the anger right here on this comment page, it's a beginning at least. Please!
Rusty Wheel · August 28, 2017 at 1:15 pm
sooooeeee these 2 ol boys co n traverse r rightoutta deliverance movie
likely fond of each other
thanks jg standin up for folks
trav not so smart, co not so nice squeel like piggies boys
Jim Griffin · August 28, 2017 at 11:53 am
And if I reported to the DOJ the occurrence of a crime you might have a point.
But I did not. Up to them, simply related to them the plain facts and words you wrote. Their determination, not mine. I have no idea the facts or the consequences, only what you reported here.
And as I pointed out in my comment, the most likely "truth" is that it's a pile of bs like everything else you write.
citizen observer · August 28, 2017 at 11:38 am
Just quoting you JG: "False police reports are also a crime, as would be encouraging one."
Contrary to your wishes I have committed no crimes. Therefore your reporting me to the DOJ is a false report.
And again thanks for your compliments. Telling me I am an embarrassment and to grow up proves you are an angry liberal with no facts to substantiate anything. Cheers!
Jim Griffin · August 28, 2017 at 10:32 am
I never said the owner of this site agrees with me about anything. Quite the contrary, I wrote that I hope he doesn't. I get along well with the publisher of the other paper, too. Boycott them and their advertisers both, it's your right.
We all agree with Lincoln: If two people think the same about anything, we don't need one of them.
False report? Simply your words. Advocating firearms? Definitely a Second Amendment supporter, and if you have issues with bears you are a fool not to visit Clark Brothers.
Grow up. You are an embarrassment to this otherwise fine community.
citizen observer · August 28, 2017 at 9:38 am
If if Dems and leftists are so upset by statues, why didn't they start protesting them before now? I guess it didn't fit a political agenda.
Traverse you are right. If the DOJ comes and talks to me, I will gladly show them this thread and they can then visit JG for filing a false report. Since he is advocating firearms I'll suggest they send a tactical squad for safety.
It's also good to know the "owner" of this site is solely on JG's side as he has advocated. If he listens to this psychopath and removes everyone against JG's liberal agenda, then perhaps it will be time to quit supporting his advertisors with our money.
BJ · August 27, 2017 at 9:37 pm
"White supremacists have called, so I must respond. As a descendant of slaveholders and Confederate soldiers, I want to tell the truth about the evil that my ancestors and the Confederacy perpetrated, the repercussions their crimes have today, and how I and other white people still benefit from discrimination against people of color." "White supremacists and Confederate apologists want other white people to join them in their half-baked fantasies of the antebellum South - plantations with white columns, dirt roads framed with Spanish moss, hoop skirts and mint juleps. But to love the Confederacy is to side with murderers, rapists, child abusers and thieves. White supremacy chokes off innovation and seeks to consolidate power within the hands of people who were too lazy and greedy to work their own land, care for their own children or pay employees for their work."
"Rallying around a statue of Robert E. Lee is the perfect encapsulation of white supremacy’s history - desperate white people going into battle because they’re scared of losing the power and comforts they’ve taken by exploiting people of color. Their invocation of “blood and soil” should be a reminder of the Africans, African Americans and indigenous Americans whose blood was spilled on American soil."
Jim Griffin · August 27, 2017 at 6:16 pm
There is a clock ticking. It's an important element in the upcoming proceedings, as your attorney will tell you. I am asking for a retraction of your false statement that "Then Jim goes on to make veiled threats by talking about his ability with a fire arm? Very inappropriate. Maybe he's the one who should be reported."
False police reports are also a crime, as would be encouraging one.
And for avoidance of doubt, you should recall that on the day in question A, co threatened a boycott of this publication's advertisers because B, I "spread liberal bs in this conservative county, and C, this publication's owner was burying his mother that day, shortly after having had to bury his father, and D, you'll find that I am friendly with both publications' chief executives and none of them buys a word of what you're trying to sell.
Now who was trying to silence who?
Ask your attorney. A retraction is in order. The lack of a retraction will be something you regret.
You make CO look bad, and I even agreed with him about the KKK priest -- had the priest made the court-ordered restitution.
Issue your retraction. Admit you have no knowledge whatsoever of me making any reportable threats, veiled or otherwise. The evidence is here in this publication and is unmistakable. You are lying. Retract your lies.
Jim Griffin · August 27, 2017 at 5:05 pm
BTW, I am fine with people here and as I've written repeatedly, happy to buy a drink or a meal, sit down with anyone. With Traverse, I invite him to meet me at Sheriff Mosier's office, which would work for me because of his escalated and increasingly irrational posts, even falsely writing that I threatened anyone. Citizen Observer? I'd sit down with him. He seems rational when he isn't name calling. We can respectfully disagree, I suspect, but Traverse you are now way over the line. I'd be contacting an attorney if I were you. Just a bit of review and preparation might be in order.
Jim Griffin · August 27, 2017 at 4:57 pm
I have the same Second Amendment rights as anyone else, and anyone who says they violate their security clearance with every post (or words to that effect) made their own issue, especially in this county.
As I wrote, whatever happens we learn something and perhaps he gains more freedom to post. Certainly hasn't kept him from posting.
We are all Socialist in Fauquier County: Schools, water, sewer, electric, broadband, land use and more -- all govt controlled, even the purchase of development rights with tax money. I admit I am what we all are, and we are neither capitalist (or you could do whatever you want with your land, for example) or communist (I hate Communists).
I suppose you, Traverse, think the Democratic Peoples Republic of Korea is A, A democracy; B, Republican; C, Democratic. Pure sophistry on your part.
I did warn you about libel and slander. Charges lead to unmasking, so be careful. For example, I have every right to exercise my Second Amendment rights. What's there to report? To falsely write that I threatened anyone, veiled or otherwise, is actionable in a Virginia court of law. Wanna get a lawyer?
I wrote that I sometimes open carry and I practice shooting in the backyard, as does almost everyone on my road. We had a bear in the house, we'd be stupid not to be able to defend ourselves. And you call those words "a veiled threat." You are a knowing liar spewing falsehoods with bad intentions. Let's go to court.
You wrote here that your friends call you "bat-shit crazy." Why must you keep proving it over and over? You are now a hair's breadth away from defending yourself in a court of law and all us discovering your identity.
You are warned. I demand a retraction now.
Traverse · August 26, 2017 at 10:15 am
Jim Griffin - Trying to shut down the debate by threatening Citizen Observer. Trying to get him fired from his job or worse. Intimidation, Saul Alinski's most potent weapon... It's what socialists do... especially when they're loosing.
Then Jim goes on to make veiled threats by talking about his ability with a fire arm? Very inappropriate. Maybe he's the one who should be reported.
Then he tries to make some kind of association between CO and Nazis. How ironic... A nasty little "Democratic Socialst"... calling someone else a Nazi (National Socialist)... they call that "transference"... blaming others for your own crimes.
Jim knows CO is no Nazi, but just doesn't care... liars gonna lie.
And that vindictive manchild keeps trying to "unmask" those of us that wish to remain anonymous. It's what socialists do... especially when they're loosing the debate.
What a creep!
citizen observer · August 25, 2017 at 5:31 pm
Good job JG! I'll be glad to talk to the DOJ. My employer has a strict social media policy because they don't want anything traced back to them that may jeopardize their security clearance. As long as I follow their policy I can pretty much say my thoughts.
I've done plenty for this country. I do not like nor support the white supremacists or Nazis. I also don't like the organizer of the Charlottesville rally using anyone or historic statues for a political agenda. I'm sure you are aware that the organizer also organized Occupy Wall Street and was a devout supporter of Obama. He suddenly "switched sides" and organized this rally as a right winger. The mayor and Governor played right along, allowed the groups to clash in front of the media, and failed to block pedestrian occupied streets. The first thing the media did was blame Trump and portray him as a white supremacist, because he correctly blamed both sides. That was their agenda. It's up to the citizens of Charlottesville to decide what to do with the statue; not a bunch of brainwashed Nazis, supremacists, BLM, or Antifa kids.
If our schools are conservative; how come Tim Kaine was asked to speak at Kettle Run HS to talk about his and Hillary's loss and against the new agenda, but a republican was not invited to speak about their view? I heard a bunch of fathers in a pub complaining about it and did some research and they were right. Also a Fauquier teacher publicly slammed the Sheriff for his immigration policies. Said her students need to be scared of the new government. This sounds a lot more like an indoctrination than an education.
Sorry I made you so mad. It's just I'm not interested in turning over our great, free country to the NWO (who wants to drop the world's population by 90% thru wars) or the highest bidder as we were headed. This country has elections every 4 years for a reason. Hopefully the DNC will start trusting their voters and allow all the good candidates to be in the primaries this time. Instead of protesting statues and rioting, people need to look down the road to the near future. Cheers!
BJ · August 23, 2017 at 6:40 pm
Say every thing Trump says or does is inappropriate or not, or that he lies or not, but is is plain that he is not the person for the job (and neither was Hillary Clinton). Would you let your meat butcher give you hernia surgery? Both the meat butcher and the medical surgeon have knowledge of dissecting a body. One is just better at it then the other when it comes to people, and leaving them alive. Blaine Johnson
Jim Griffin · August 23, 2017 at 11:19 am
Now we know what a "brown shirt" really is, brown being the color of defecation. On this day, our host and editor (Lou Emerson) is burying his mother, while on these pages a person who admits they violate federal law with every post threatens our host's livelihood on account of his publishing opinions with which the person disagrees.
(And maybe Lou disagrees, too -- I hope everyone disagrees in some way. Like Lincoln said, if there are two here who think the same way we don't need one of them.)
So much for "free speech" when the claim is that I "spread liberal BS into a conservative county like Fauquier," our home for over 12 years.
So I reported this person to this US Department of Justice today. Whomever they are deserves it. Whatever happens, we'll learn something: Either we will discover it is no big deal and they can post with their real name, or they will lose their security clearance (after which, of course, they can post with their real name). Or, perhaps most likely, it's a pile of BS the likes of which he/she has been spreading here.
Conservative? I know no one with a 13yo kid in the local schools who is not conservative. I sometimes open carry (hint) and other times practice target shooting and home defense scenarios (bears, don't you know, one of which broke into the house years ago at midnight). I do not feel like a liberal, did not vote for Clinton, but perhaps I should have done so now that I meet the alternative head on: Bigotry, fascism, Nazis and their defenders.
Live and learn, eh? I'd much rather die than succumb to this sort of madness. I'm defending the good county I know and love. Whatever citizen observer is defending is long gone, if it ever existed here. I've never lived in a better place.
Jim Griffin · August 23, 2017 at 9:55 am
CO: You are a guy admitting he is violating the conditions of his security clearance. I encourage Lou to do the right thing and report you to our federal government for the on-going legal violation that occurs here. If he does not I will. I am absolutely serious.
citizen observer · August 23, 2017 at 9:44 am
Says a guy from Chicago, LA, and Crystal City who has lived here all of 10 years and is trying to spread liberal BS into a conservative county like Fauquier. Good to know the editor strongly supports you. I'll be sure to start letting his advertisors know I will no longer give them my business because they support the liberal takeover of free speech.
Continue on with your mindless rants. I'll leave you alone.
Jim Griffin · August 22, 2017 at 12:52 pm
All the more reason to shun you! If you are violating a security clearance this is over. I assume you are telling the truth so this is the end. After this message we leave you to the important work on behalf of our country.
Lou (Emerson, the Editor) knows me well. I've offered to buy a meal or share a drink with anyone here. I am easy to look up online and in real life. I live in The Plains. This is my community and I am proud to be part of it for well over a decade, more than two decades a Virginian.
As regards Traverse, it is weird he fears vandalism for his car when his views are pro-Trump, who won in Fauquier. My views are more likely to lead to vandalism here and yet I feel it is only right I use my real name. I started doing so when Lou requested it online.
I definitely respect Cameron Jones more for his outspoken nature. It draws out my sharpest commentary and considered thinking. I'd happily drink or eat anywhere with him. Respect brings better dialogue, but his nature makes mine tougher in discourse.
citizen observer · August 22, 2017 at 12:34 pm
JG, thanks for the compliments. You need to learn to read better. I can be held accountable for any posts, whether on the job or off. Has to do with a security clearance. How do we know you are using your real name? Perhaps I should just use something like John Smith or Alfred Neuman and say I'm a proud citizen, how would you know? Comparing me to the snipers shows how incapable your thought process are becoming.
Jim Griffin · August 21, 2017 at 7:42 pm
Citizen observer, observer, Traverse and the like have proven themselves incapable of civil discourse. I applaud Blaine for trying, but you simply cannot engage them in reasonable discussion.
An explanation: They write without using their real names. They communicate without responsibility or accountability. There are many good people in this community who choose not to communicate with them at all for just this reason. Those who ignore this often regret it.
CO says it's because his employer takes a dim view of social media posting on the job. Easy answer: Don't post while on the job. Traverse claims he is intimidated. Really? What does it say about you when you will not stand behind your POV with honest accountability? It's as if they attend public meetings in hoods.
As a result, they take half-baked positions based on the likes of Alex Jones. They are the rhetorical equivalents of the Beltway Snipers, shooting hidden in the trunk of a car.
Those who represent themselves in this way are a stain on this good community. We can only hope those thinking of locating a business here ignore the comment section. It ain't pretty.
The great irony: This opinion piece in large part excoriates those who wear masks in public places to hide their identity. CO, observer and Traverse -- among others -- exemplify in comments the substance of the editorial's main complaint. It may be time to restrict comment to verified commenters else the deterioration of the neighborhood will continue.
citizen observer · August 21, 2017 at 5:51 pm
Trump has revoked Obama's executive order bypassing Congress with the Clean Water Act. If you read it the EPA has the power to take a pond located entirely on your property for no reason.
He stopped millions of dollars of taxpayer money being used by agencies in overtime scams. The list goes on but you won't see it covered by the liberal media.
BJ is on Tim Kaine's staff "Taking it to the Streets" to protest Trump for beating him and his corrupt queen. He would much rather our freedom be sold out to the highest bid offered to the queen, than offer any support to the guy that stopped it.
BJ · August 21, 2017 at 3:53 pm
Traverse - what exactly has Trump done since he came into office? He has reversed most of the policies enacted during Obama's tenure and other previous Presidents, gone golfing, and spent at least $100 million of taxpayers money on his personal enjoyment. At least I can look in the mirror Traverse, you are too blind to see what is there when you look into yours. Bite me! How's that for childish? lololo
Traverse · August 21, 2017 at 1:35 pm
B.J. doubles down on his willingness to slander reputations, thinking it will somehow validate his political views, and blurts that President Trump is... "without shame and honesty".
His remarks are selfish, childish, and disgusting.
If you're looking for the problem BJ... look in the mirror... you are it.
martinkus · August 21, 2017 at 1:19 pm
The Roman Empire is upon us...outside forces will not topple us...our country continues to divide further and further...we may very well destroy ourselves from within...the current events are very sad indeed.
BJ · August 21, 2017 at 11:39 am
Traverse - you could do with some schooling because you are completely off base, and very uninformed. You at correct on one thing when you write, "There’s nothing Trump can ever say or do that will ever convince" me that he is without shame and honesty. Watch as more and more people pull away from his businesses, therefore taking away money from him, it won't be long now. The only agenda I have is to live a peaceful life with my family and not have to worry every day that this pompous blowhard will destroy this country completely. Blaine Johnson
Traverse · August 21, 2017 at 8:45 am
Trump - living rent free in BJ's head.
Trump has already moved on from Charlottesville, as he should. There’s no sense in trying to have an honest discussion with the dishonest.
BJ and like-minded leftists continue to misrepresent Trump’s words and his position on racism, violence, and hatred. Trump has denounced these things all is life, and did so repeatedly after Charlottesville, but that’s of no consequence to BJ. There’s nothing Trump can ever say or do that will ever convince them that their delusional fantasies of a racist President are not real.
Example after example of how the left just cannot be trusted has been shown again and again. They know no shame and will slander anyone… neighbors, family, friends, strangers... the President… anyone… to further their agenda.
Shameful. Dishonest. Dangerous.
BJ · August 20, 2017 at 7:49 pm
CO- Every time Trump does away with a policy or program implemented while Obama was in office is a blatant sign he blames Obama for how screwed up this country is right now, in Trump's mind. Think about it.
BJ · August 20, 2017 at 10:40 am
I can only guess as to the reasons that most of the Republican in Congress aren't pushing to have Trump removed. 1. They secretly agree with most of what he is doing and saying. 2. They are more concerned about Pence with his extreme religious leanings. 3. They want to get their agenda pushed threw before deposing the President. 4. They too have no idea how to lead and make sound decisions. And writing of Pence....not a peep out of that corner about what is going on in the country! Only thing keeping him in the WH is that Trump can't fire the VP in my opinion. I don't hate Trump some of the stuff he has done is OK (illegal is illegal no matter how you look at it), neither do I like him (creepy). He isn't the best or right person for the job that is plain to see if supporters would only take off their blinders. He is leading (or not) down the wrong path for all the citizens of the United States of America.
BJ · August 19, 2017 at 5:43 pm
CO - "I haven't heard Trump blame Obama for anything." Then you haven't been listening. If you want to learn where our country is headed if Trump's governing continues you might want to read up on President Peron in Argentina.
I understand that we are on different sides of the fence and that isn't likely to change, so I'll bow out of these comments as we are both wasting our breath.
citizen observer · August 19, 2017 at 2:51 pm
Sshrader, socialism sounds like Utopia. Unfortunately what is not being told about socialism is not everyone is equal. There is still the rich, ruling elitist class; and then everyone else.
Don't full yourself that Ted Turner, George Soros, the Hollywood elites, or any of the ultra rich on either side is going to give up and share their fortunes with anyone. They intend to dissolve the middle class with the poverty stricken and will call it equality.
You don't have to look any further than Venezuela to see how socialism really functions.
citizen observer · August 19, 2017 at 2:41 pm
Because Trump hasn't done what Obama did and completely clean house. He trusted leaving some in sensitive positions and has paid the price. It is going to take some time to address the problems he was elected to clean up. Obama still in the "background" makes it harder. One can only imagine the response if Bush had done that to Obama. Oh, and didn't Obama blame Bush for everything for many years? I haven't heard Trump blame Obama for anything.
The Republican Congress doesn't like him because he is actually a Democrat. He switched sides because the DNC wasn't allowing anyone to compete against Hillary. The Republicans are in such disarray he competed against 16 candidates and won. The Democrats don't like him because he isn't a bought and paid for politician like most of them are.
The media adds to the issue by emphasizing the Not My President protests by a couple of million people out if a population of 323 million. They could have just as easily shown the other 320 million hard working people going about their lives and happy we were being sold out to the highest bidder by Hillary. It just doesn't fit their agenda to report all the news.
BJ · August 19, 2017 at 12:48 pm
CO - Why do you keep bringing up Obama? He isn't President, this stuff is all happening on Trump's watch. Please think before making any more excuses for "poor" Trump. Even with a Republican majority in the House and Senate he can't get things done. And as far as appointments being delayed, you reap what you sow. The Republicans slowed the process down for Obama, so now it's the Democrats slowing it down for Trump.
Traverse: Millions of people were disenfranchised when Trump was elected. Remember the "Not My President" chants all across the nation?!
sshrader · August 19, 2017 at 11:03 am
traverse- I am always surprised to see the hate of democratic socialism. Seeing old beater trucks with "socialism sucks" stickers strikes me as funny since the driver is one of the many who would probably have a much happier life were we less capitalist. Maybe the sticker should say "our current execution of social programs sucks"
Democratic socialist- "Democratic socialists believe that both the economy and society should be run democratically—to meet public needs, not to make profits for a few. To achieve a more just society, many structures of our government and economy must be radically transformed through greater economic and social democracy so that ordinary Americans can participate in the many decisions that affect our lives.
Democracy and socialism go hand in hand. All over the world, wherever the idea of democracy has taken root, the vision of socialism has taken root as well—everywhere but in the United States. Because of this, many false ideas about socialism have developed in the US. " (http://www.dsausa.org/what_is_democratic_socialism
BJ · August 19, 2017 at 11:02 am
Traverse - you know what they say about assuming anything.
Traverse · August 19, 2017 at 8:51 am
BJ says "Trump is a hate monger", which is the exact opposite of the truth. A perfect example of actual hate mongering. Knowingly spreading a false narrative maliciously created by the vindictive left to malign a good man's character. A vain attempt to give meaning to the rejection of the Democrat socialist agenda by the American people, and to invalidate a duly elected President, and in the process, disenfranchise millions of Americans.
I don't know BJ, so I won't call him a liar, and will assume he's just one of the millions of people willingly fooled by the fake news.
citizen observer · August 19, 2017 at 8:39 am
We all have had relatives and friends fight in wars. Unfortunately until humans learn to get along wars are inevitable.
Trump has a big mess to clean up from Obama, the worst President in history. And I voted for him in 2008. I knew I made a mistake when we gave him almost a trillion dollar bailout and he gave it to his Wall Street and political cronies, instead of putting people to work fixing our infrastructure and ghettos like he said he was going to do. There are people in Chicago mad he has never delivered on his promises there. He used poor people to get into power and turned his back on them when he did.
He started the current civil unrest by not being a leader during Ferguson and Baltimore and telling people violence has no place. Instead he encouraged it because it fit his agenda of divide and conquer. His boss Soros spent lots of money for his NWO takeover and is not allowing it to be wasted. He has his media stir up hate at every opportunity.
The crazy white supremacists came back into the news because Obama embraced the BLM and their war on police. How come you only blame Trump for this madness?
I am not a big Trump fan but he is our President and deserves the support the news and voters gave to Obama. If the media and voters had been half as diligent on Obama as they are on Trump we wouldn't be in this mess.
Hillary didn't care about anyone that wasn't giving big money to her pay to play money laundering scheme called the Clinton Foundation. She would have sent this country down the drain. That is why she lost. People need to wake up.
It amazes me that Lee monuments are the only ones people want taken down. Plenty of people owned slaves that are memorialized by statues. Unfortunately left wing teachers obviously haven't been teaching the whole history story to their students.
The good thing about this country is we have elections every 4 years. Violent protests and destroying monuments are not the answer. Leave it up to local electorates to do as their voters wish.
BJ · August 18, 2017 at 8:31 pm
CO- I did not ADMIT to being a Trump hater, I do however think he is the worst President since the beginnings of this country. Didn't vote for Clinton either, another out of touch rich person trying to get richer. I'd like to see all campaign contributions stop and term limits. No more pensions after elected officials leave office, and they have to buy the same health insurance the rest of us do. I'm interesting in ending the hate on all sides, I want to enjoy my senior years without being sick to my stomach every time I turn on the news. My parents and Grandparents told me how bad the Depression and World War II were for the family with 3 uncles going to war. During World War I our family sent 4 men off to war. I had 2 Uncles in Korea, and a Brother-in-law in Vietnam. I served during the first Persian Gulf War. I had a nephew serve in Afghanistan. My family has served this country in some capacity back to the American Revolution. Believe me when I say that we know what hate can do, and we will do whatever it takes to make sure that hate-mongers do not thrive in this country. Trump is a hate-monger and needs to resign.
citizen observer · August 18, 2017 at 2:52 pm
BJ, Here is one of several arrests. This isn't even the guy I was talking about. I see you admit being a Trump hater. Probably why you're only interested in stopping the hate on one side. The good news is we have another election scheduled in 2020. Hopefully the DNC will begin to trust their voters again and allow all the good candidates into the primary race; instead of telling them who their candidate will be. Trump didn't win this election, voters saw thru Hillary and she lost it.
And JG I don't endorse anyone molesting youth. The difference is the BLM is making money off of sex trafficking. Haven't been able to find any articles about the Boy Scouts involved in sex trafficking. If you have some please share. Who is Alex Jones? When you get to name calling it begins to show ignorance.
BJ · August 18, 2017 at 2:39 pm
Jim, the less I hear coming out of Mr. Trump's mouth the better, and he already stepped in it, too late to clean that mess off his shoes. Heard on NPR today that he fired Steve Bannon, about time!
BJ · August 18, 2017 at 2:35 pm
In every group, club, church, school, military, workplace, every place there are people you will find a bad apple or two. Jim, you are correct in saying that we can not malign the whole because of a few, with the exception of hate groups, gangs, pedafiles, rapists, and murderers. No one's hands are clean when it comes to doing the right thing, some just have dirtier hands than others.
Jim Griffin · August 18, 2017 at 2:20 pm
CO may simply be an Alex Jones bot. Now CO is recycling crap from earlier messages in the same thread.
To repeat, there was plenty of media coverage about the BLM activist arrested, just as there was plenty of media coverage about, say, Boy Scout officials charged with rape, child porn, and so on. It says nothing about the organization, nor do we condemn and shutter every religion and charitable organization because an "activist" involved was charged for crimes of moral turpitude.
Another Alex Jones conspiracy, CO? Shall we dump on Catholics next? Or is there a Rabbi you want to malign? Maybe a teacher? How about kids?
Jim Griffin · August 18, 2017 at 1:48 pm
Romney suggests Trump acknowledge his comments were wrong in an address to the nation and “state forcefully and unequivocally that racists are 100% to blame for the murder and violence in Charlottesville.”
Trump, Romney said, should also make clear “there is no conceivable comparison or moral equivalency between the Nazis — who brutally murdered millions of Jews and who hundreds of thousands of Americans gave their lives to defeat — and the counterprotesters who were outraged to see fools parading the Nazi flag, Nazi armband and Nazi salute.”
BJ · August 18, 2017 at 10:21 am
Those violent groups have been in this country WAY before Obama took office. And where did you get your information on BLM? Didn't hear any of that in mainstream news. Please state your source.
BJ · August 18, 2017 at 10:18 am
...and NEVER have been.
BJ · August 18, 2017 at 10:17 am
CO - lots of things are being left out of the news with all the "noise" coming from the WH at this time. While everyone is focusing on that "noise" much is being pushed to the background. Shut the "noise" off and maybe the rest of this country can hear what is going on outside the WH and work on stopping it. P.S. Not a fan of Hillary & Bill Clinton, and have been.
citizen observer · August 18, 2017 at 9:25 am
Oh, and speaking about sex trafficking; how come no media coverage of the BLM leader having dinner with Obama at the White House and arrested a couple of weeks later pimping out an underage girl in a Maryland motel?
citizen observer · August 18, 2017 at 9:06 am
And how were all those violent groups getting into the US. Oh, that's right; Obama opened the borders. Funny how Senators Obama, Clinton, and Schumer are all on news tapes in 2005-2006 saying Bush needed to control illegal immigration and build a wall. What made them all suddenly change? Perhaps Soros money?
I am against all the evil on both sides. I'm getting the impression you are okay with leftist evils but worried about the rightist. Both sides need to be shut down if you truly respect your Edmund Burke.
BJ · August 17, 2017 at 6:28 pm
citizen observer - you forgot MS-13, the Russian Mafia, the Chinese Mafia, Sex traffickers, and the illegal drug providers. There are many such groups destroying this country. "The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing" Edmund Burke - Are you a good man CO or a proponent of evil?
citizen observer · August 17, 2017 at 12:41 pm
Well said Traverse. The media and social media are destroying this country.
Senator Kaine told his constituents to take it to the streets. Not what I expect of elected officials.
BJ- I have no use for white supremacists and Nazis. I also have no use for BLM and Antifa advocating the killing of police officers.
Traverse · August 17, 2017 at 7:46 am
My take always from Charlottesville:
Apart from the disgusting display of violence, hate, and racism displayed by both the white supremacists and the Antifa groups, followed by the righteous condemnations that have been heard from all decent Americans, including President Trump, the fact that the left and the press (but I repeat myself) cannot be trusted not to use such disgusting acts to slander the reputations of good decent people, is one of the big take always.
I watched the riots unfold with a tear in my eye and a lump in my throat, as we all did (minus a few hateful idiots from both the left and the right). The white supremacists were there to provoke, and Antifa was more than happy to oblige, with a lying and dishonest press standing by, salivating at the chance to use the whole disgusting affair to malign the President and all his supporters. And they did, along with many other liberals, including many here in this comment section.
I watched President’s press conference live. I listened carefully to his remarks, and his words could not have been clearer that he condemns in the strongest terms, all acts of hate, violence, and racism. I agreed with everything he said, and the tenor of his remarks, including his snipes at a clearly hostile press. I agreed that no “side” in this riot should get a pass, and that many violent acts of hate were to blame.
I also watched in disgust as the press immediately took everything President Trump said in that press conference, an turned it around 180 degrees, bald face lie after bald face lie, “news” program after “news” program, pontificating that that he actually meant the complete opposite of what he clearly said. I witnessed the complete and final death of journalism… now a rotting corpse in America.
The press is going to cause another civil war in this country if we useful idiots let them… it may have already started … and they’ll be there to fan the flames, slander more reputations, falsely lay blame where is does not belong, pour more gas on the fire, and cover the whole thing… good for ratings you know.
God bless Heather Hayer and her family. May the monster who ran her down rot in his cell, waiting for Lucifer to take his soul.
BJ · August 17, 2017 at 6:49 am
citizen observer - yes, there has been racism in this country from the beginning, and some Presidents (and other politicians) have embraced it. The frightening thing with today is that social media engages a larger audience of people, some unstable and lost, and makes hate into an all consuming monster. That is how radicalism starts and grows.
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